cheap labour

[elmo]

guess were going back in time.. like 30 years!!!!!!
now challenger expects their drivers to manually unload .. handbomb fingerprint... whatever you want to call it..... freight..... ie.. diapers yes diapers !!!
where scm cornwall.....
drivers beware......
btw. this is not a rumour... lolll:moodswings:

[BlackIce]

guess were going back in time.. like 30 years!!!!!!
now challenger expects their drivers to manually unload .. handbomb fingerprint... whatever you want to call it..... freight..... ie.. diapers yes diapers !!!
where scm cornwall.....
drivers beware......
btw. this is not a rumour... lolll:moodswings:I suppose Mr Challenger is looking to grab whatever garbage freight he can and cut costs wherever he can with him losing a large chunk of the Purolator/Canada Post contract to others.

[red_5.0]

Waiting 6 hrs in the dock for below minimum wage to unload diapers in Mississauga is why I quit OTR. This was after waiting 17 hrs for the 'appointment' time, and only earning 300 some miles for the whole 2 day process out of P&G in PA.

I will also not shop wally world for this reason. This stuff has to end. Nothing short of slave labour.

[ratfink]

Thats the way everyone see truckers, cheap labor!
P and G wont pay for unloading relying that carriers will do anything to get some freight.

wally world in cornwall will threaten you and your company that if you refuse to unload the damn load they will fine 1000 bucks, dispatch will do all he can to force you into it.

you refuse to do it, you have earned a trip to mr safety to explain yourself. more loss of time because youre out of service until "mr safety", "mr cut it al" or "mr terminal manager" clears you after a long speach warning you about future consequences of course huh?

if this crap comes to me, I refuse to touch the damn thing 1000 bucks or not, I dont care.

I'm a driver, not a lumper!
but how many newbies who are easy to intimidate will do it?

[1-800-bigtruck]

Why is it that a receiver orders their diapers but don't want to unload them .

[ratfink]

$$$$$$$$$$$$

They dont want to pay personel to unload it at theyre warehouse.
They dont want to use lumpers to unload it more $$$

They know damn well that carriers will force theyre drivers to do it.

Most of the time, it's the deal between carriers and shippers the goods are sold "delivered at your door free of charge".

AGAIN THE DRIVER IS USED AS BARGAINING CHIPS!

[elmo]

1000 bucks or 10000 no difference to me.. no touch freight . that is where i stand.... mr safety better keep a low profile... mr. safety is gonna learn a new word... "discrimination" ie.. why do i have to do it and someone who will remain nameless for now!!!!! does not have to??? esplain to me lucy!!!!!loll

[Izzy]

1000 bucks or 10000 no difference to me.. no touch freight . that is where i stand.... mr safety better keep a low profile... mr. safety is gonna learn a new word... "discrimination" ie.. why do i have to do it and someone who will remain nameless for now!!!!! does not have to??? esplain to me lucy!!!!!loll

Maybe if you don't want to touch the freight you should look for another job.

Maybe as a dispatcher.

[ralph]

Maybe if you don't want to touch the freight you should look for another job.

Maybe as a dispatcher.

You don't have to anything that drastic. Just tell the carrier to pound sand! There LOTS of driving jobs where a driver doesn't have to finger print diapers/freight. Carriers can hire and pay for the lumper(s). Do trailer switches and move to the next load.

If the carrier pays by the hour then I guess lumping is OK...bet it pays by the 100 weight at best. A dime a hundred I am guessing.

[BlackIce]

Maybe if you don't want to touch the freight you should look for another job.

Maybe as a dispatcher.Perhaps Mr dispatcher should be sent out to unload every handbomb load.
At a rate of $25 per trailer.

[elmo]

well tell you what!!!!! iF I WAS A DISPATCHER... there are quite a few things that would be done differently... like RESPECT for the driver...
might not last long in that position.. but it would be worth a try...

[ralph]

Perhaps Mr dispatcher should be sent out to unload every handbomb load.
At a rate of $25 per trailer.

BlackIce, you are making the dispatcher out to be the bad guy/gal in all of this. The dispatcher is just the guy/gal that passes the freight on from the order department. If you are looking for the bad guy/gal in this go back to sales as they are the ones that made the deal and after them go to operations because they said OK to the deal.

[BlackIce]

BlackIce, you are making the dispatcher out to be the bad guy/gal in all of this. The dispatcher is just the guy/gal that passes the freight on from the order department. If you are looking for the bad guy/gal in this go back to sales as they are the ones that made the deal and after them go to operations because they said OK to the deal.In quite a few companies the dispatcher is the order and operations department.

In this particular instance I suspect that the 'new' poster might be someone that is pro-management.

[ralph]

In quite a few companies the dispatcher is the order and operations department.

In this particular instance I suspect that the 'new' poster might be someone that is pro-management.

Are we not referring to CMF and hauling diapers in this thread>They should be hauling the diapers in reefer trailers because reefer guys are exposed to that nonsense all the time and understand it!

[BlackIce]

Are we not referring to CMF and hauling diapers in this thread>They should be hauling the diapers in reefer trailers because reefer guys are exposed to that nonsense all the time and understand it!Are you suggesting that that makes it an acceptable practice?

I wonder perhaps if this isn't a topic that could be discussed by some of your management type friends over at insidetransport.
I know some of them issue surcharges for all SCM loads and quite a few refuse to accept SCM loads because of this type of issue.

[ralph]

The comment was made as a slight joke...we all know how much time reefer guys spend either lumping or paying lumpers.

I have no problem with carriers hauling this freight...I won't but if Challenger wants to and can make money at it that's entirely their perogative. If the drivers choose NOT to lump freight I would support them entirely. The term truck driver to me does not mean lumper BUT if a driver wants to unload the freight and is adequately compensated for doing the job, then I am OK with it. I haven't heard what the compensation rate is for a load of diapers. Maybe it's worth it for a driver to "break a sweat" for a few hours.

[BlackIce]

The comment was made as a slight joke...we all know how much time reefer guys spend either lumping or paying lumpers.

I have no problem with carriers hauling this freight...I won't but if Challenger wants to and can make money at it that's entirely their perogative. If the drivers choose NOT to lump freight I would support them entirely. The term truck driver to me does not mean lumper BUT if a driver wants to unload the freight and is adequately compensated for doing the job, then I am OK with it. I haven't heard what the compensation rate is for a load of diapers. Maybe it's worth it for a driver to "break a sweat" for a few hours.The ONLY compensation rate which would and should be acceptable is an hourly rate equal to that of their normal earnings that is paid from the time of arrival to the time of departure. Those hours should also be counted towards daily/weekly overtime pay.

[ratfink]

BlackIce, you are making the dispatcher out to be the bad guy/gal in all of this. The dispatcher is just the guy/gal that passes the freight on from the order department. If you are looking for the bad guy/gal in this go back to sales as they are the ones that made the deal and after them go to operations because they said OK to the deal.

Also to be fair, the word "dispatcher' as changed a lot in trucking.

Today, in big carriers is now more a planner, The person will plan a load on a driver and it's the driver manager who has to deal directly with the driver, by phone or sat.

In other words, the DM is more or less the buffer between higher managment (planers, directors of operations etc.) and has to "enforce" decisions that has been taken regarding just about anything involving the driver in his or her daily routine.

Now with big carriers, cmf, highland, sunberry name it, theyre all using that system.

Most of the time, the DM dont have much control over the decisions taken.

They have to enforce it and "convince the driver that this is the best load available for them, in other words, they have to sell you the load to the driver, get you to take it using any way to convince you.
believe me, we heard everything from them.

If the driver still refuse to take it, even after negotiations, the next step in this system is to advise mr safety or mr operation manager depending companies.

At this point the driver will have a little meeting and will be explained that he has to do whatever mr DM ask him (maybe not in those words but you get the picture huh?) and sent back to work.

Oh and this will be added too the drivers file.

if the drivers keeps refusing loads, could be for any reason, dont do NYC, not enough miles for his week, hanbombing whatever.
The procesus starts all over again, another meeting takes place.
each time it gets a bit ruffer and more events are added to the file.

When I say a bit ruffer, I've seen 2 or 3 people scaring drivers, the driver is sitting in a chair and operation manager, safety guy and sometimes another monkey all over the driver. A bit like you see in movies when police are interogating people.

try this with somebody who is har d to influence or intimidate, and all hell will break loose but as some people are a holes, they know who to scare huh?
the driver slowly becomes a problem driver.

I'm not saying that EVERYBODY is doing that, I'm saying that it's been done in different level of agressivness depending on companies and people involved.

I've seen it and got involved one time because I thought they were pushing a bit too far with a driver.

All this to say that a lot of times, the DM or whoever is dealing with drivers are stuck in that system (just as the driver) and are just doing what higher managmnt are telling them to do.

[ratfink]

Just like any other trade, plumber, electrician, whatever!

[ratfink]

The ONLY compensation rate which would and should be acceptable is an hourly rate equal to that of their normal earnings that is paid from the time of arrival to the time of departure. Those hours should also be counted towards daily/weekly overtime pay.


Just like any other trade, plumber, electrician, whatever!

[Mule Bleue]

The comment was made as a slight joke...we all know how much time reefer guys spend either lumping or paying lumpers.

I have no problem with carriers hauling this freight...I won't but if Challenger wants to and can make money at it that's entirely their perogative. If the drivers choose NOT to lump freight I would support them entirely. The term truck driver to me does not mean lumper BUT if a driver wants to unload the freight and is adequately compensated for doing the job, then I am OK with it. I haven't heard what the compensation rate is for a load of diapers. Maybe it's worth it for a driver to "break a sweat" for a few hours.

The bigest problem is that nobody tell the driver till he get at scm, tadamm you have to unload body!!! I don't think that's fair, an if you refuse the scm lady is telling you that there's no lumper service here an that if you don't unload Cmf will be paying a FINE of $1000.00. TOTALLY RIDICOULUS. Who the heack are they??? When you go shopping at wm do they lower price for you because you have unload their FFFFF precious load of diapers ( The main reason why they are doing this is to keep their FFFFFF operation cost lower as possible on our back) Personnelly I do refuse any load that I suspect that it have to be Driver unload. Even if they would pay me to do it, IT IT NOT THE DRIVERS JOB TO DO SO, IS THAT CLEAR ENOUGH!!!!!!!! I remember delivring a load once in Boucherville an the owner want me to unload the freight with his forklift truck an I refuse, he was so unsulted that he made a complaint to Cmf an say that we would never return there, great. When i got back to terminal never hear about it.

Shipper an consignee to ABUSE of the drivers they do consider us cheap labor for fffff free, no way!!!!! If we all refuse to unload their precious freight what are they gone a do, fired the drivers not sure. It is their freight so it theirs ffffffffff resposabilty to unload or load not ours. The fact to refuseas nothing to do with any Union , it justa matters of BIG COMMON SENSE.

[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:

[BlackIce]

The bigest problem is that nobody tell the driver till he get at scm, tadamm you have to unload body!!! I don't think that's fair, an if you refuse the scm lady is telling you that there's no lumper service here an that if you don't unload Cmf will be paying a FINE of $1000.00. TOTALLY RIDICOULUS. Who the heack are they??? When you go shopping at wm do they lower price for you because you have unload their FFFFF precious load of diapers ( The main reason why they are doing this is to keep their FFFFFF operation cost lower as possible on our back) Personnelly I do refuse any load that I suspect that it have to be Driver unload. Even if they would pay me to do it, IT IT NOT THE DRIVERS JOB TO DO SO, IS THAT CLEAR ENOUGH!!!!!!!! I remember delivring a load once in Boucherville an the owner want me to unload the freight with his forklift truck an I refuse, he was so unsulted that he made a complaint to Cmf an say that we would never return there, great. When i got back to terminal never hear about it.

Shipper an consignee to ABUSE of the drivers they do consider us cheap labor for fffff free, no way!!!!! If we all refuse to unload their precious freight what are they gone a do, fired the drivers not sure. It is their freight so it theirs ffffffffff resposabilty to unload or load not ours. The fact to refuseas nothing to do with any Union , it justa matters of BIG COMMON SENSE.

[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:[smilie=real mad.gi:Spot on Mr Mule!!

[Noname]

Uh ya, The lumper, handbomber, fingerprinter, Mr. Gomore Pile, Whatever you want to call it, gets paid $between 8.50 and $12/hr and the agency he/she works for gets $19-25/hr, more if a forklift cert. is required (24-25). The loads are up to 50LB per person legal payload but they look the other way and expect to have us lift beyond what wcb would legally cover...

To get out and lump for 25-30 minutes for light loads is okay if you have time to warm up and stretch, otherwise it's dangerous for your cartilage and joints and will lead to skeletal degeneration starting from your feet as the footbed collapses causing microtears in your feet. Everyone could use the exercise for a bit. I do have a problem when they are not willing to help the driver unload at all and you're expected to do it by yourself.

[elmo]

well well well...... now the "rumour "has it that... cmf are hauling in the drivers who refuse to unload 3000 cases of diapers at scm ie wal-mart and asking "what are your plans next time you receive a similar load assignement.... and you better have a doctor's note if you refuse" now.. what i would like to know is... who the f... at challenger has the right to volunteer my services ????? and in my honest opinion if cmf wants to haul cheap freight... well it's their problem to get it unloaded... i did not order it .. i did not sell it to walmart. i just take it from point a to point b . period ..
no wonder their turnaround of drivers is so high!!!!! and now begging drivers to work with them as a team... yeah god luck on that!!!!

[Noname]

Are they paying you by the hour to unload the truck?

[elmo]

Are they paying you by the hour to unload the truck?


it,s not really the point.. but it might be........lollll
not my job.. period but.. i could be a slow worker,,,,, maybe 12 -14 hours to unload
how about that?????

[JimmTwo]

One alternative would be to take the load to the nearest WM, and park on the side of the road, and sell it for less then WM. Everyone gets paid. :10_1_138[1]:
Then call the yard /dispatch, where do you want me to go........Hard time, maybe a little ticked, sell the truck & trailer...... will drive them nuts:laugh1:

just a thought.

[junior]

If you are being paid and I don't no that you are what is the deal with unloading the diapers? This has gone on forever at one time in this industry driver unloaded all of there freight. Blackice and Ratfink calm down my Dad in his Teamster job did recieve his hourly rate to do it at P and G Hamilton. He was low man on the totem pole and the company and the union said it is part of the job. He went in there and handbombed loads of tide everyday for a couple years it was expected. If CMF is trying to get it done for free well that is a different story. I too hate SCM and refuse to send my guys in there unless the lumpers are unloading and the 3pl pays waiting time. If my driver wants to do it then he gets the lumper fees some guys like it a little execise.

As far as sitting drivers down and threats etc that will bite them in the ass the economy is coming around and drivers value to larger companies will increase.

You guys are busting everyones balls over this and that but please try and remember we are just coming out of the biggest downturn in the economy since the 30's. Drivers are not the only ones taking a hit and doing more for the same money. Thousands lots there jobs in this industry in the last couple years it is starting to come around. Your time is coming.. Believe it or not lots and lots of owners and managers took pay cuts in the last couple years MOST drivers didn't..

[bikerboy]

it,s not really the point.. but it might be........lollll
not my job.. period but.. i could be a slow worker,,,,, maybe 12 -14 hours to unload
how about that?????

always sounds kinda funny when drivers complain " it's not my job" try that at an all hourly paid non union job, and see how long you last, if you are being paid hourly for it, you should do what your told as long as its safe and legal.

[BlackIce]

If you are being paid and I don't no that you are what is the deal with unloading the diapers? This has gone on forever at one time in this industry driver unloaded all of there freight. Blackice and Ratfink calm down my Dad in his Teamster job did recieve his hourly rate to do it at P and G Hamilton. He was low man on the totem pole and the company and the union said it is part of the job. He went in there and handbombed loads of tide everyday for a couple years it was expected. If CMF is trying to get it done for free well that is a different story. I too hate SCM and refuse to send my guys in there unless the lumpers are unloading and the 3pl pays waiting time. If my driver wants to do it then he gets the lumper fees some guys like it a little execise.

As far as sitting drivers down and threats etc that will bite them in the ass the economy is coming around and drivers value to larger companies will increase.

You guys are busting everyones balls over this and that but please try and remember we are just coming out of the biggest downturn in the economy since the 30's. Drivers are not the only ones taking a hit and doing more for the same money. Thousands lots there jobs in this industry in the last couple years it is starting to come around. Your time is coming.. Believe it or not lots and lots of owners and managers took pay cuts in the last couple years MOST drivers didn't..MrJunior, believe it or not but in the many prosperous years leading up to the recent downturn lots of owners and managers took large pay raises while MOST drivers got nothing.
Not even a basic cost of living increase.
Drivers day is coming you are correct in stating that. But the owners and managers had better prepare themselves to stop treating drivers as 3rd world slaves because otherwise the owners will need exceptionally long LCVs driven by themselves to move their customers freight.
The status quo and operational bs by owners and management over the past 20 plus years no longer works.

[ratfink]

The status quo and operational BS by owners and management over the past 20 plus years no longer works.

And thats what its all about.
the driver shortage was created by companies abusing and taking the drivers as bargaining chip because they could.

Couples of years ago someone came up with a study saying that 300000 people in canada had commercial drivers licences in theyre pockets and are doing something else for a living!
I cant find the study but the age group was 35 to 60 years old.
that meant that experienced drivers left the industry and not coming back.

Ever wondered why they left???
they were wasted by our rocket scientist from the 80's to today.

Oh and another thing, I'm calm, actually very calm.

Like I said the older generation did put up with the BS. My dad did it too and I did until now.
The new generation wont and will leave.

You say that your dad did this, union and company told him it was part of the job. Ok, I understand that, my dad did it too and me too, it was part of his job description, part of the contract he had with the company.

But nowadays, the job description changes depending on how low the carrier has to get his pants down to get the customer.

And pls stop saying that our poor primadonnas took a pay cut and not drivers.

Oh and another thing, I'm calm, actualy very calm.

[bikerboy]

I agree young drivers won't put up with BS, i know very very few people my age or younger who drive trucks. they just don't see any reason to want to do it. lots of other jobs pay better with better hours and better home life.

[Pipeman]

I agree young drivers won't put up with BS, i know very very few people my age or younger who drive trucks. they just don't see any reason to want to do it. lots of other jobs pay better with better hours and better home life.And you're driving a truck because they're smarter than you and have better jobs??? What's your point?

[bikerboy]

And you're driving a truck because they're smarter than you and have better jobs??? What's your point?

i do it because i love operating big heavy trucks,and everything about trucks and the challenges of it. but for someone who doesn't have that same passion, they would not like trucking.

its not really a job to me, its my life, if i couldn't be involved with trucks, i have no idea what else i would want to do.

[Mule Bleue]

Here's a little story about cheap labor; I've unload one load at cmf by hand, it was in feb 1995 at Bradless store dist center, brantree,ma. The load was of about 4 950 plastic base for patio, those plastic base that you put either water or sand in it for weight to hold up patio umbrella. Anyway when it get there at nite the security gard assign me a door an tell me that they will wakr me up in morning.

At 07:00 tock tock on the door an get in the building an the lift opoerator tell me that I have to sort a put them on skids an shrink wrap the whole thing after. I look at him an refuse, he tell me to call my dispatch so I did an I've been advise strongly to do so if not I'll reprimend when return to dorval. I was new with cmf an no one to tell me if that was rite or not. Anyway it took me 13 hours to do the whole thing, oh an I have to also pull the skids on the dock.

When i received my pais i've been paid $13.00 for a live unload, how FFFFFF impress I was .
That have been the only load that I've unload by hand since then. I've always refuse to do so even if they want to pay me by the hours I REFUSE.[smilie=real mad.gi:

[Containercrew]

If anyone here needs lumpers in the Greater Toronto Area please let me know. I understand most lumping companies are not easy to deal with but give us a shot and we will do our best to keep you satisfied. info (at) containercrew (dot) com

[jimbo47]

diapers for ffs ...when dispatch wanted us to toe the line/make a point ,spoke back , We were given loads of fitness depot to deliver .
what i mean is driver to carry goods to end o trailor,,not so good when 2 skids of weights at front which is regular.
Never anyone to assist unloading (usualy 1girl & manager on duty) no forklift ,only 2 pallet jacks available for al lwest bc stores..so i was told.
No joking i once bought 2 street people lunch for helping me unload .
$15 per drop ...%^$% used to take at least 2-3hrs .
never so glad when i got onto a set run doing .SK_AB roundtrips for another client. funny enough it only seemed to be us new canadians doing fitness deliveries.
j